4ad-l Mail for 03-20-1996

Mail in Archive

Subject: Re: ESP Continent
Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 22:56:29 -0600
From: a bear of very little brain (hk@NEOSOFT.COM)
Subject: Re: chapterhouse (was re: lovelife)
Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 23:15:44 CST
From: the boy in zinc (eewittme@STUDENTS.WISC.EDU)
Subject: Re: "This Rimy River" ltd.ed. / What's up with 4AD mailorder??
Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 21:56:19 -0800
From: Immanuel Kan (immanuel@IX.NETCOM.COM)
Subject: Milk & Kisses (one more...)
Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 23:11:45 -0600
From: "Jose A. Garcia Camil" (pepegtc@HALCON.LAGUNA.UAL.MX)
Subject: Re: Blueshift Signal
Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 22:07:00 -0700
From: drew schwickerath (schwicke@CS.COLOSTATE.EDU)
Subject: Re: milk and kisses pushed back further still
Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 21:49:40 -0800
From: Micah Newman (mnewman@WESTMONT.EDU)
Subject: Re: Mojave 3, Lush LIVE
Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 22:48:56 -0800
From: Stephen Rusk (srusk@UVic.CA)
Subject: Re: "This Rimy River" ltd.ed. / What's up with 4AD mailorder??
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 00:34:14 -0800
From: [suppressed]
Subject: Lush, Cocteaus, Stereolab
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 09:24:47 +0000
From: Andrew Norman (nja@LEICESTER.AC.UK)
Subject: Gear: Slowdive/Mojave, Lush
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 06:59:59 -0500
From: Inbred Djed (larry@INTERLOG.COM)
Subject: Re: Love and Rockets
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 07:13:57 -0500
From: daniel klyn (owilde@UMICH.EDU)
Subject: belly list
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 08:35:23 -0500
From: BRITOBROS@AOL.COM
Subject: Re: Re; finally heard lush
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 11:17:01 EST
From: Dez (100702.123@COMPUSERVE.COM)
Subject: Re: ESP list
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 13:11:53 -0500
From: Where is my Mind? (friday@APOCALYPSE.ORG)
Subject: Re: 4AD box set..
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 12:18:41 +0000
From: Sunday Records (sunday@PYROTECHNICS.COM)
Subject: Re: 4AD box set..
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 12:18:42 +0000
From: Sunday Records (sunday@PYROTECHNICS.COM)
Subject: Re: "This Rimy River" ltd.ed.
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 19:44:41 +0100
From: Emiel Efdee (efdee@LUNA.NL)
Subject: Re: milk and kisses pushed back further still
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 10:22:38 -0700
From: ".mark." (vonminde@RINTINTIN.COLORADO.EDU)
Subject: Re: chapterhouse (was re: lovelife)
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 10:41:22 -0800
From: Chris Lundeen (lundeen@LULU.MOSCOW.COM)
Subject: Lilliput
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 13:19:19 -0600
From: Me (neitzl@TEZCAT.COM)
Subject: look elsewhere
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 10:01:22 -0800
From: Dewdrops Records (nelson@ASTRO.UCLA.EDU)
Subject: Re: milk and kisses pushed back further still
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 11:16:35 -0800
From: Jens Alfke (jens@MOOSEYARD.COM)
Subject: Re: "This Rimy River" ltd.ed.
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 22:54:14 +0100
From: Emiel Efdee (efdee@LUNA.NL)
Subject: Re: "This Rimy River" ltd.ed.
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 15:22:02 -0600
From: "Jose A. Garcia Camil" (pepegtc@HALCON.LAGUNA.UAL.MX)
Subject: Bowery Electric: another sucker-for-noise says yes
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 12:24:01 -0800
From: Micah Newman (mnewman@WESTMONT.EDU)
Subject: Re: Re; finally heard lush
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 13:42:15 -0800
From: cz (cz@U.WASHINGTON.EDU)
Subject: Re: Lilliput
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 22:54:17 +0100
From: Emiel Efdee (efdee@LUNA.NL)
Subject: Re: ESP list
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 14:23:39 -0800
From: Heffalump (n9344881@HONEYDEW.CC.WWU.EDU)
Subject: a question
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 16:47:25 -0600
From: John Nguyen Van (jvskip@OWLNET.RICE.EDU)
Subject: Chapterhouse
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 16:53:00 CST
From: Stratton Davis (stratt@E-TEX.COM)
Subject: Re: a question
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 16:38:22 -0800
From: Jens Alfke (jens@MOOSEYARD.COM)
Subject: is nothing constant?
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 15:23:42 -0800
From: Dewdrops Records (nelson@ASTRO.UCLA.EDU)
Subject: drum, send that book!
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 19:17:38 -0600
From: John Monroe (5ES8MONROEJ@vmsa.csd.mu.edu)
Subject: 4ad-jp web site update
Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 11:37:35 +0900
From: Masaya Toyokawa (toyokawa@LIB.BEKKOAME.OR.JP)
Subject: 4ad-jp web site update
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 22:21:03 -0500
From: Srilank@AOL.COM
Subject: violane and halfgifts
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 20:33:36 -0600
From: Me (neitzl@TEZCAT.COM)
Subject: Re: ESP Continent
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 18:43:50 -0800
From: Vada Pinson (brettg@NETCOM.COM)
Subject: Prog Uber Alles (Re: a question)
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 21:15:28 -0600
From: a bear of very little brain (hk@NEOSOFT.COM)

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 22:56:29 -0600
From: a bear of very little brain (hk@NEOSOFT.COM)
Subject: Re: ESP Continent


Vada Pinson wrote:
> There was one thing that I
> found kind of annoying and that was the static sound that is supposed to
> sound like a scratched disc or something. Wasn't this already done on the
> Liquorice album? I swear it is the same sound. It is just down right
> annoying. I guess it is supposed to be clever because it is so damn
> "ironic" to find this in music that was flowing together so well. Anyway,
> I realize that I am overreacting and should just ignore it. Anyway..

I don't think you're overreacting; however, I also think this is all a matter of
taste.
Personally, I like all the distorted, screwed-up bits on the disc.  They provide
an
entertaining counterpoint to the overall atmosphere of the album, and they kinda
keep you
on your toes (again, this is entirely a matter of preference, but I like surpris
s in my
music, especially surprises that are both totally left-field yet somehow congrue
t, and
perhaps this is why I thoroughly love all the cleverness that flows out of Noise
Camp,
Livonia).


hk
--
hk@neosoft.com and farrago@delphi.com or http://www.neosoft.com/~hk/
"the horrible noise comes in and completely destroys your orgasm...
 ...on the playboy channel (nooooooooo....)" -- negativland


Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 23:15:44 CST
From: the boy in zinc (eewittme@STUDENTS.WISC.EDU)
Subject: Re: chapterhouse (was re: lovelife)


>Speaking of two disc sets, has anyone heard that two-disc Chapterhouse
>album?  I've never heard anything by them, but I saw it for $6.00 used.
>What do they sound like?

blood music (the two disc-er) is really bland, imo.  the bonus disc is
actually better than the album, and i might buy the album for $6, but ONLY
FOR THE BONUS DISC.  their first album, whirlpool, is much better, but kind
of spotty (some of the songs are brilliant, some just ok).  i definately
recommend this one as it finds its way into my cd player fairly often.  it's
dreampop ala curve -- a little more electronic than ride (when they were
good.)  rachel goswell sings backing vocals on "pearl."

interestingly enough, "pentamerous metamorphosis," global communication's
retranslation of "blood music," is pretty good, and includes a sample from
return of the jedi, which i thought was particularly cool.  ("how many
languages do you speak. . .i am fluent in over six million forms of
communication. . .")

i've heard that chapterhouse's early eps (pre-blood music) are great,
particularly mesmerized, so pick 'em up -- if you can find them anymore.

BiZ

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 21:56:19 -0800
From: Immanuel Kan (immanuel@IX.NETCOM.COM)
Subject: Re: "This Rimy River" ltd.ed. / What's up with 4AD mailorder??


how much is this TRR?  what's the content?  is it all the 4ad cover
arts?

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 23:11:45 -0600
From: "Jose A. Garcia Camil" (pepegtc@HALCON.LAGUNA.UAL.MX)
Subject: Milk & Kisses (one more...)


Just recieved a pre order form form Intergalactic Garage (igg@intrepid.net)
with the following:

>>THE COCTEAU TWINS Milk And Kisses CD (UK) 4/12 [$24.95]  $22.5
>>        Special limited edition packaging.

I suppose that 4/12 is april 12, so there=B4s the release date. The price at
the right is when you do the preorder (i=B4m saving a HUGE $1.5 ...)

Hope this clears some F@#|=AC%g frustration (including mine) =B4bout the=
 release
date...

Pepe
*************************************************
'The Picture you see, is no portrait of me...'
                                     NewOrder
*************************************************

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 22:07:00 -0700
From: drew schwickerath (schwicke@CS.COLOSTATE.EDU)
Subject: Re: Blueshift Signal

              from "Nunayer Dambiznis" at Mar 16, 96 03:16:09 pm

a fellow listie wrote:
> I recently picked up the Bedazzled comp. "Woke up Smiling" and have
> absolutely fallen in love with the song "Halo" by Blueshift Signal.
> I was wondering if anyone out there owns or has heard their
> self-released disc "Seven Natural Scenes"?  Is it anywhere near as
> stunning as Halo?

i haven't heard "halo" yet, so i don't know how it compares.  however,
i picked "seven natural scenes" up a while ago for a couple bucks (us)
in the bargain bin.  i like it.  unfortunately my player at work is
munged, so i'm only now sitting down after a few months and
relistening to it as i write this (and i'm reminded what a nice album
this is).

"seven natural scenes" basically splits itself between sort of a
"ocean blue"-esque sound and instrumental etherealism.  some of the
songs, such as "oceans" pretty much gets the sound right, and does and
great job at it.  songs like "acquiescence" and "hehaka olowan" are
drawn-out-guitar-note instrumental.  nice and relaxing.  again, a nice
album.  stunning?  i'm not sure i would say that.  perhaps "warm and
comfortable" would be a better description - at least for me.

okay, not much of a review.  practice practice practice - drew

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 21:49:40 -0800
From: Micah Newman (mnewman@WESTMONT.EDU)
Subject: Re: milk and kisses pushed back further still


On Tue, 19 Mar 1996 hortman_m@HCCS.CC.TX.US wrote:

> You know, I'm getting really pissed off with the release date continuing to be
> pushed back.  Some of us aren't as "in-the-know" as others to have "obtained"
> a copy of this 4 months ago.  :(
>
>
> What is this shit?  I don't want a bootleg of it; I don't want a tape of it; I
> don't want to pay $40 for a copy "ahead of time".  I want to be able to go to
> the goddamn store and buy it for $13.
>
> I'm tired of reading reviews of this CD.  I've been deleting them because I
> want to hear it for myself first before I read someone else's opinion of what
> the cocteaus do/do not sound like.
>
> fuss fuss fuss bitch moan crab crab crab frika fraka brika braka where in the
> hell is milk and kisses
>
> I wish Fontana or Capital (or whoever the hell is distributing it) would get
> their collective head out of their ass and release it already!

        Amen, bro. I'm with that all the way. People should actually
contact Capitol and let them know what a load of shit this endless delay is.


Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 22:48:56 -0800
From: Stephen Rusk (srusk@UVic.CA)
Subject: Re: Mojave 3, Lush LIVE


Marcus Jeremy Smith was looking for details of the gear these bands
use. I know some of Lush's stuff:

Gibson ES-335 twelve string [I'm selling mine - broke some fingers:(]
Epiphone twelve string [Casino-12? Similar to the 335]
Rickenbaker twelve string [340-12? Not used much now]
Gibson Firebird Non-Reverse

Mesa/Boogie combo [DC-5?]

Fender Stratocaster Hendrix Reissue
Fender '72 Telecaster Thinline
Fender Jazzmaster [Not used much]
Gibson SG

Mesa/Boogie Studio Caliber rackmount
Alesis Quadraverb

Fender Precision
??? [Some whacky bass I didn't recognize in the Single Girl video]

Stephen


Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 00:34:14 -0800
From: [suppressed]
Subject: Re: "This Rimy River" ltd.ed. / What's up with 4AD mailorder??


By the way, does anyone know if I could still get a copy?  Or has it all
been sold out for quite some time?  Also, how many bones are you people
throwing down for this thing?

On Tue, 19 Mar 1996 BluBelKnol@AOL.COM wrote:

> In a message dated 96-03-19 09:41:28 EST, you write:
>
> >Anyone got his 'This Rimy River' deluxe book yet? Aren't 4AD just a bunch of
> >cheats? Charging people's credit cards and clearing cheques in January and
> >delivering the stuff (hopefully!), more than 2 months later!
> >
> >
>
> i too, have not received my "TRR" ltd.ed. as of yet.  and they too, charged
> my visa account in late january.  they mailed me the receipt along with a
> note that said ".. it will be shipped in march".  what they probably meant
> was that they would be shipped march 31st, and we (overseas) would get them
> about 10 days afterward in april.  or, as i joked to a friend that we would
> all get them on april 1st to lets us know what fools we've been to pay so
> much for something and then have to wait so long for it.  if you ask me, as
> patient as we've been, 4AD should send us a free CD or something.
>
> -blubelknol@aol.com
>


Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 09:24:47 +0000
From: Andrew Norman (nja@LEICESTER.AC.UK)
Subject: Lush, Cocteaus, Stereolab


Thislisty heaven in the shops yesterday - new albums by Lush and
Stereolab, and the new Cocteau Twins single.

Cocteau Twins - Tishbite.
The tune of the A-side is naggingly familiar, perhaps "Goodbye
Blackberry Way"?  B-sides are good, "An Elan" has a hint of "O
Superman" and there are a couple of passages where the guitars sound
almost "Head over Heels" -ish.  As others have said, there's nothing
too surprising here, but that's a good thing since the last time the
twins surprised me was by including large chunks of "Meditations for
Women who Read Too Many Self-Help Psychoanalysis Books" in their
lyrics.  Odd phrases are audible in these songs, but nothing
stomach-crawlingly awful.  The sound is somewhere between
"Victorialand" and "Heaven or Las Vegas".  Combined with the last two
EPs, I think there's a definite return to form.

Stereolab - Emperor Tomato Ketchup.
In a flimsy Tortoise-style cardboard sleeve (not *quite* as flimsy as
"Millions Now Living...", but almost), thirteen tracks, just under an
hour.  As with the Cocteaus there are no shocks - some strings here, a
bit of xylophone there, the guitars get cranked up in a couple of songs,
rather too much gently swinging funk (but not too funky) for my taste.
It will probably grow on me - there's a fair bit of variety - but they
aren't the band who had me foaming at the mouth after I bought "Lo-Fi".

Lush - Lovelife.
Great album.  A dozen pop songs, just right for one side of a C90 (I
have finally found something to couple with the Air Miami album).  The
Jarvis Cocker duet works better than I expected, and "Olympia" is the
sort of song Stereolab could cover without too much adjustment.  Despite
the cleaner, brighter production, there's still a lot of atmosphere, odd
samples and poetry recitals, and the songwriting is consistently good.
Don't be put off by the mountain of sub-standard B-sides, the album is
absolutely superb.

--
Andrew Norman, Leicester, England 20/03/96
nja@le.ac.uk, http://www.engg.le.ac.uk/staff/Andrew.Norman/
Radio 4


Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 06:59:59 -0500
From: Inbred Djed (larry@INTERLOG.COM)
Subject: Gear: Slowdive/Mojave, Lush


Mark wrote:

>This is a call/challenge to any fans of Mojave 3/Slowdive and Lush. Does anyone
>know the complete live set up of my fave bands? I'm talking amps, guitar
>pedals - the hole kit n' keeboodle. I would really like to know the specifics
>on amp and guitars makes, what pedals or keyboards they use, and extra stuff
>they carry around with them on tour.

Slowdive (or at least Neil) were notoriously secretive about their effects
rigs, to the point of covering them with sheets at the side of the stage.
Now that they're not using the stuff in Mojave, though, they might be a bit
more forthcoming. The only thing I'm sure of was that Neil used a Digitech
Echoplus pedal and an Alesis Quadraverb, but there's more to it than that.
Slowdive were big on Roland JC-120 amps. Neil played a Rickenbacker and I
think a Telecaster, Chris played a Strat, Rachel played a Tele Thinline and
very occasionally a Gibson ES-335 (shown being played by Neil on the photo
on the Pygmalion sleeve. Nick played a Music Man bass. Some of the time, anyway.

Miki plays a Rickenbacker 12-string, a Gibson ES-335 12-string, an Epiphone
version of the same, and a Gibson Firebird. Emma plays a Tele Thinline, a
Strat, a Jazzmaster and a Gibson SG with a Melody Maker neck through a
Quadraverb (previously a Roland GP-16) and a Digitech whammy pedal. Both use
Marshall JCM-800(?) amps.

Suddenly feeling like going to a guitar store...

Larry

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 07:13:57 -0500
From: daniel klyn (owilde@UMICH.EDU)
Subject: Re: Love and Rockets


Has anyone else an opinion regarding 'Sweet fa'?  I really liked 'hot
trip..'. would i like the new one?  reply privately or publicly, it
matters little.

dan


Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 08:35:23 -0500
From: BRITOBROS@AOL.COM
Subject: THIS MORTAL BOX / scheer


Hello!

Continuing with sob stories in the vein of "my Lilliput was destroyed by a
leaky roof..."


MY TMC BOX WAS IRREPARABLY DAMAGED! I am looking for a completely new copy of
it (still in shrink-wrap if possible). If anyone has seen one in a store or
etc., please refrain from deleting this message (because these "looking
for..." posts are annoying I know) and let me know.

My own roommate has damaged mine and, yes, he will die, because I place CDs
above the value of human life (actually not, but TMC are pretty up there in
my book).

Also...

The new scheer EP 'Shea' is very good. It's all been said before, but they
are worth a second glance/listen. Also, the cover of 'Infliction', out next
week I believe, looks to be a direction v23 would've taken with Pixies had
they not died. A big crudely stitched-up wound. Yummy!

Gram


Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 11:17:01 EST
From: Dez (100702.123@COMPUSERVE.COM)
Subject: Re: Re; finally heard lush


Don't want to start a flame war but.....


> the reason that i personally subscribe to this list is precicely because
> of a real 'category' (or 'classification,' if you like) of music/art
> which _is_ 4AD.  A rigid category only inasmuch as 4AD (at one time??)
> held its talent to rigid standards of excellence.

Excellence like 'Labour of Love' by Mass, or the wailing wankfest that was
Richenel, or Spirea X?

> That's why we're dissatisfied with the new lush album.  Not because it
> somehow challenges our monolithic standards for how a 4AD record should
> 'sound', but rather, our very articulate  standards for how a
> 4AD record should be 'made'.

Standards how a 4AD record should be made? What on earth is that supposed to
mean? This is pure snobbery. What annoys me about this whole stream of criticism
about the Lush album is that you miss the point of it by a street. It is a pop
album. Lush have made a punchy, direct pop album. You may think it is a great
pop album, or you may think it's rubbish. That's not my problem (personally I
place somewhere between the two extremes). What is my problem is people like you
arrogantly dismissing it because it doesn't sound like you think it should. And
I bet you were one of the people wringing their hands and jumping up and down
when 4AD rejected the new Red House Painters tapes. Just a little hypocritical?


> We aint pining for a return to the 'good old days'. Those late eighties
> 4ad records were quite ahead of their time. And thats what we want still.
> We want to be swept off our feet, taken captive.  Not bored by shit we
> could find on any other label, in any other genre.

In the late 80s, 4AD found themselves in the fortunate position of having the
two greatest rock bands on the planet at that time (Muses and Pixies), Dead Can
Dance at the peak of their powers, and the Cocteau Twins still a little while
away from pissing away their reputation. Times like that happen rarely. If you
look back further a few years, you see a label stuck with a fourth division
Siouxsie and the Banshees (X-Mal), sub-New Order goths (Xymox), and dire pap
like Modern English's third LP. Golden era - like fuck. If 4AD do have a problem
(apart from being saddled with myopic fans like you), it's that Ivo's relocation
to plastic-city California has led the label to lose touch with the most
exciting music scene in Europe since punk, if not ever.

And since when was 4AD a genre?

- Dez

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 13:11:53 -0500
From: Where is my Mind? (friday@APOCALYPSE.ORG)
Subject: Re: ESP list


>I'll ask again -- what was decided in regards to a Warren Defever/ESP
>discussion-based mailing list?  I recall one person saying something to
>the effect of "I'll set it up over the weekend," but if anything was
>posted following that, I've missed it completely.

I'm setting it up...
I'll announce to the list how to subscribe once it's up and running.

Thanks for your patience,
reid

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 12:18:41 +0000
From: Sunday Records (sunday@PYROTECHNICS.COM)
Subject: Re: 4AD box set..


This MOrtal Coil box set...thanks

> >Hi
> >
> >I;m looking for a coyp of the 4AD box set....can anyone help
> >thanks
> >albert
>
> Ummm... which one?  There are a few out there.
>
> Jake
>
> Who wishes it didn't take so damn long to drive to L.A. from S.F.
>
>


Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 12:18:42 +0000
From: Sunday Records (sunday@PYROTECHNICS.COM)
Subject: Re: 4AD box set..


This Mortal Coil box set

> > I;m looking for a coyp of the 4AD box set....can anyone help
>
>
> Lonely Is An Eyesore?
> Cocteau Twins EPs?
> Dead Can Dance Box?
> Dead Can Dance TTW video/CD?
> This Mortal Coil Box?
>
> Which one?  These are just off the top of my head...
>
>
> marvynHortman      Director FAQ --> ftp://sharedcast.hccs.cc.tx.us
>
>

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 19:44:41 +0100
From: Emiel Efdee (efdee@LUNA.NL)
Subject: Re: "This Rimy River" ltd.ed.


>how much is this TRR?

=A3150,--

>what's the content?

We don't know...

>is it all the 4ad cover arts?

This version wil be ART itself (we hope)


There is also a normal edition of This Rimy River available. It's a
catalogue for a v23 exhibition in L.A. (1994). Graphic works 1988 - 1994.
23 pages (a lot more but every pagenumber is 23 and I can't count).


Emiel Efdee
...
the Netherlands, March 20, 1996
... efdee@luna.nl

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 10:22:38 -0700
From: ".mark." (vonminde@RINTINTIN.COLORADO.EDU)
Subject: Re: milk and kisses pushed back further still


On Tue, 19 Mar 1996, Micah Newman (in response to marvyn's rant) wrote:
> >
> > I wish Fontana or Capital (or whoever the hell is distributing it) would get
> > their collective head out of their ass and release it already!
>
>         Amen, bro. I'm with that all the way. People should actually
> contact Capitol and let them know what a load of shit this endless delay is.

strangely enough, american record companies are still completely in the
dark about fanbases like the one the cocteau twins have.  i was talking
to someone in the promo department of capitol a couple weeks ago, and she
was actually really upset about the most recent delay of the release.
she, a huge cocteaux fan herself, felt it showed a lack of faith in the
band on the part of capitol.  i mentioned to her that if fontana planned
to release m&k on time that most of the hardcore cocteaux fans would buy
the import, and that would basically screw capitol sales-wise and screw
the cocteaux american-charts-wise.  strangely enough, she hadn't even
thought of that!

i know some of you are sick of hearing about it, but i must say that m&k is
absolutely wonderful..."serpentskirt" blew me away on first listen.  wowza!

.xxx....

----------------------------------------
.mark. (vonminde@rintintin.Colorado.EDU)

now w/silly website:

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 10:41:22 -0800
From: Chris Lundeen (lundeen@LULU.MOSCOW.COM)
Subject: Re: chapterhouse (was re: lovelife)


Hey, I have been trying to find this for a LONG time, and am having no
luck.  If anybody could help me track down a copy I would be VERY
appreciative!!!  Reply in private please, so as not to waste everyone
elses time.
                        Thank you in advance,

                                - Chris

On Tue, 19 Mar 1996, the boy in zinc wrote:
>
> interestingly enough, "pentamerous metamorphosis," global communication's
> retranslation of "blood music," is pretty good, and includes a sample from
> return of the jedi, which i thought was particularly cool.  ("how many
> languages do you speak. . .i am fluent in over six million forms of
> communication. . .")
>
> i've heard that chapterhouse's early eps (pre-blood music) are great,
> particularly mesmerized, so pick 'em up -- if you can find them anymore.
>
> BiZ
>
>

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 13:19:19 -0600
From: Me (neitzl@TEZCAT.COM)
Subject: Lilliput


        Ive been wondering, what the hell is on this Lilliput that everyone
is so crazy over???????? =20
  =20
   As well as "my pencil writes"!   :)

  thanks for any info
ernesto

=D6=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=
=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=
=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3
"You are the sweetness in my eyes         You are an apple in disguise
 You are the sweetness i need for life    You are the sweetness in my eyes"
                                      =20


Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 10:01:22 -0800
From: Dewdrops Records (nelson@ASTRO.UCLA.EDU)
Subject: look elsewhere


I think the most level headed thing to keep in mind is
what Ivo said in the AP interview: if 4AD isn't giving you
what you want anymore, then look elsewhere. I think it's
part of human nature to idolize or worship things like individuals
or bands, and even record labels, making them larger than life,
giving them artificial guidelines in one's own mind of
what they're like and how they should behave, and revelling in
the fact that YOU know every little detail about them
because it makes YOU feel important, especially if there
is some small but fiercely dedicated following to pump up each
other's feelings of elitism. There's nothing wrong with being
a fan to a certain extent. Haven't we all been guilty of
many of these things? I know I have. It's fun to think you're
part of something and to show your appreciation. And who here
hasn't at one time or another considered themselves a little more
"connected" to the music world and maybe even a little "better"
than the average joe since you know what 4AD is and can
list a dozen or more of their bands? I don't think there
is really anything wrong with a certain amount of this.
It's when "fandom goes bad" that the troubles start. Maybe it
takes over a significant part of your life, and you start,
in essence, "wearing your Star Trek uniform out in public"
to stroke your over-inflated sense of self-importance.
You start to whine about every little (or big) change that
doesn't match your unrealistic, stone-carved tablets stating
"Ivo shalt not dump a band until they've worn out
their welcome" or "Ivo shalt not covet thy neighbor's slide guitar".
What matters most is that the person in charge still believes
in what he's doing and is doing the best he can. Some bitching
and moaning is inevitable and tolerable, but what it comes down
to is if you don't like the new direction your idols have taken,
then let them fall in your mind and look for new ones. Move on,
because they're not going to hold on to something they've outgrown
just because YOU want them to.


|     Brant Nelson | 1817 Corinth Ave. #10 | open your eyes
| Dewdrops Records | LA, CA 90025-5567     | to northern skies
| Uncommon music that deserves to be heard |
| http://www.astro.ucla.edu/students/nelson/dewdrops.html

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 11:16:35 -0800
From: Jens Alfke (jens@MOOSEYARD.COM)
Subject: Re: milk and kisses pushed back further still


daniel klyn asks:
>playing medium-sized outdoor venues, with HNIA as opening
>band. and dcd/cox  flipping a coin to determine who goes on first....
>instant poll: what does the list think about a fantasy tour such as the
>one described above.

Yuck. Large venues are, well, _large_, which makes it harder to get up
close and see and hear the performance. I hate going to any show that
will have more than a few hundred people.

MY fantasy along these lines would be the Cocteaux playing a small club
like Slim's or the Kennel Club in SF, or even the Edge in Palo Alto which
is somewhat larger but much closer to home.

__________                                            __________________
Jens Alfke                                            jens@mooseyard.com
             Dinosaurs early, dinosaurs later,
             Dinosaurs jammed in an elevator!   ________________________
                                                http://www.mooseyard.com


Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 22:54:14 +0100
From: Emiel Efdee (efdee@LUNA.NL)
Subject: Re: "This Rimy River" ltd.ed.


>Where can I find the normal edition of TRR? Is it the one on 4AD mail order?


Yes.

you could also try to find it in a good book store - with a lot of
art/graphic design books...


Emiel

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 15:22:02 -0600
From: "Jose A. Garcia Camil" (pepegtc@HALCON.LAGUNA.UAL.MX)
Subject: Re: "This Rimy River" ltd.ed.


>There is also a normal edition of This Rimy River available. It's a
>catalogue for a v23 exhibition in L.A. (1994). Graphic works 1988 - 1994.
>23 pages (a lot more but every pagenumber is 23 and I can't count).


Where can I find the normal edition of TRR? Is it the one on 4AD mail order?

Pepe
*************************************************
'The Picture you see, is no portrait of me...'
                                     NewOrder
*************************************************

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 12:24:01 -0800
From: Micah Newman (mnewman@WESTMONT.EDU)
Subject: Bowery Electric: another sucker-for-noise says yes


        A couple of weeks ago I ordered the Bowery Electric CD from
Kranky through mail order, just like the nice listies told me to. I got
it yesterday, and it is indeed magnificent. Definitely worth only $11,
which is less than I paid for a _cassette_ of Lovelife, over the counter
at the WhoreHouse... um, Wherehouse.
        It's repetitive but it sure works like a charm. "Slow Thrills", for
example, is pure sonic ecstasy--driving away at that one "chord" or whatever
the heck the guitarist is playing (definitely a "wet" signal if there ever was
one!) and two bass notes for ten minutes. Sounds tedious? It isn't, but you
have to hear it to believe it. The drumming is a bit tipsy and
amateurish, though, but the music is none the worse off, so never mind.
        I don't have the Kranky address with me, but I can go get it if
anyone wants it.

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 13:42:15 -0800
From: cz (cz@U.WASHINGTON.EDU)
Subject: Re: Re; finally heard lush

              Wed, 20 Mar 1996 11:17:01 EST

Dez sez:
>   Don't want to start a flame war but.....
    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Yeah right!  I smell something foul.

>   This is pure snobbery.
>   What is my
>   problem is people like you arrogantly dismissing it
>   because it doesn't sound like you think it should. And I
>   bet you were one of the people wringing their hands and
>   jumping up and down when 4AD rejected the new Red House
>   Painters tapes. Just a little hypocritical?
>   If 4AD do have a problem
>   (apart from being saddled with myopic fans like you),
>   it's that Ivo's relocation to plastic-city California

If you have a personal problem with the original poster then please take it off
the list.  Your abusive nature is unwarranted.  You're calling someone arrogant,
hypocritical, and myopic because they think that 4AD can be classified by it's
adherence to a standard of excellence?

>   And since when was 4AD a genre?

Read your own quoted material!  This is not a point of dispute (why are ranting
on about it?).

>   > the reason that i personally subscribe to this list is
>   precicely because
>   > of a real 'category' (or 'classification,' if you
>   like) of music/art
>   > which _is_ 4AD.  A rigid category only inasmuch as 4AD
>   (at one time??)
>   > held its talent to rigid standards of excellence.

I personally think that Ivo has tried to maintain a "standard of excellence."
He mostly succeeds in his attempts.  Each person's criteria for excellence are
different but i do think that *if* there is a cohesive categorization of 4AD
(early, mid, and perhaps even late) it is *Ivo's* standards of excellence.
(N.B., this is not a genre.)

-cz

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 22:54:17 +0100
From: Emiel Efdee (efdee@LUNA.NL)
Subject: Re: Lilliput


>        Ive been wondering, what the hell is on this Lilliput that everyone
>is so crazy over????????


Ah... just some old tracks:

CD 1

Bauhaus - Dark Entries

The The - Controversial Subject

The Birthday Party - Nick The Stripper

Modern English - I Melt With You

This Mortal Coil - Song To The Siren

Xmal Deutschland - Incubus Succubus II

Cocteau Twins - The Sprangle Maker

Xymox - Stranger

Colourbox - Baby, I Love You So

Throwing Muses - Hate My Way

Dif Jus - No Motion

M|A|R|R|S - Pump Up The Volume

Ultra Vivid Scene - Mercy Seat

Dead Can Dance - The Host Of Seraphim

Pixies - Monkey Gone To Heaven

Lush - De-luxe


CD 2

Pale Saints - Throwing Back The Apple

Pale Saints - Featherframe

The Wolfgang Press - A Girl Like You

The Wolfgang Press - Birmingham

Michael Brook - Breakdown

Michael Brook - Urbana

Spirea X - Chlorine Dream

Spirea X - Signed D.C.

Heidi Berry - Gloria

His Name Is Alive - Are We Still Married?

Swallow - Tastes Like Honey

Swallow - Follow Me Down




I don't own a copy, does anyone have one left? I will pay $10 :)



Emiel Efdee
...
the Netherlands, March 20, 1996
... efdee@luna.nl

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 14:23:39 -0800
From: Heffalump (n9344881@HONEYDEW.CC.WWU.EDU)
Subject: Re: ESP list


On Wed, 20 Mar 1996, Where is my Mind? wrote:

> I'm setting it up...
> I'll announce to the list how to subscribe once it's up and running.

Ah - good to hear it!  Thanks for letting me know.

Mike


Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 16:47:25 -0600
From: John Nguyen Van (jvskip@OWLNET.RICE.EDU)
Subject: a question

              from ".mark." at Mar 20, 96 10:22:38 am

 hi can someone please tell me what 'prog' means and what makes a
 band sound 'prog'?

                thanks

                John

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 16:53:00 CST
From: Stratton Davis (stratt@E-TEX.COM)
Subject: Chapterhouse


Does anyone out there have that really cool dub remix of 'Precious One' by
Chapterhouse?  I remember hearing it in a club back in '91 and loving it.
If somebody does have it and would tape it for me, I would send postage and
a tape or maybe do some trade for other stuff of interest.

Reply privately:  stratt@e-tex.com

thanks,

Stratton


Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 16:38:22 -0800
From: Jens Alfke (jens@MOOSEYARD.COM)
Subject: Re: a question


John Nguyen Van asks:
> hi can someone please tell me what 'prog' means and what makes a
> band sound 'prog'?

Dunno what this has to do with this list, but 'prog' is short for
'progressive', which in the '70s was what they called rock that tried to
get more complex by bringing in elements of jazz and/or classical music
-- mostly weird time signatures, very long songs, "concept" albums and
non-rock instrumentation.
In other words: Yes, Pink Floyd, Genesis, ELP ...
It was a good idea at first but eventually succumbed to pompousness and
pretentiousness.

Mostly dead now although a few crusties still worship it. Prog was one of
the primary things that punk was designed to tear down and destroy.

__________                                            __________________
Jens Alfke                                            jens@mooseyard.com
             Dinosaurs early, dinosaurs later,
             Dinosaurs jammed in an elevator!   ________________________
                                                http://www.mooseyard.com

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 15:23:42 -0800
From: Dewdrops Records (nelson@ASTRO.UCLA.EDU)
Subject: is nothing constant?


Elysium News (Glendale, CA)
On par with all the other changes everyone's going through
around these parts, three weeks ago guitarist Tony decided to
quit the band on a moment's notice, three days before an upcoming
show. After the initial shock wore off, the remaining three members
took this change in stride, realizing that this was very likely
a blessing in disguise which would let them be a lot more free
to experiment and have fun. But at the same time, it was obvious
that some things would definitely be different. John has moved from
bass to guitar, while vocalist Jenny has taken up bass. There are
also plans to find a drummer (contact me by email if interested;
any trial drummers should be familiar with at least some of
the following: Dif Juz, Half String, Icicle Works, Orange,
Lush, and Scenic). A small handful of songs will never be performed
again, but there are loads of new ones in the works.

With one Tony-less show under their belts which they admirably
threw together in three days, another one is coming up tonight
night at Priscilla's in Glendale (near the confusing Pass / Riverside
intersection). This time local band Honeywater is donating
their vocalist Sarah and guitarist Benny for the show. Practice
last week sounded very good, and it's bound to be a fun evening
for the ElysiumWater Experience.

Admission is free, and the show starts around 9pm. CDs and 7" singles
will be available as usual.

|     Brant Nelson | 1817 Corinth Ave. #10 | open your eyes
| Dewdrops Records | LA, CA 90025-5567     | to northern skies
| Uncommon music that deserves to be heard |
| http://www.astro.ucla.edu/students/nelson/dewdrops.html


Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 19:17:38 -0600
From: John Monroe (5ES8MONROEJ@vmsa.csd.mu.edu)
Subject: drum, send that book!


Once again, I bother a list full of people to try to get kelli-jeanne
drum to send the V23 book I sent her money for, when, 14 months ago???
I wouldn't be doing this on a list if she would return personal mail,
and she knows I would do this, as I told her, and have done so in the
past... and was told that she was sending it. right, sure...

and apologies to absolutely everyone else, this is the worst type of list
mail and i know it, but also the worst type of dealings, the ones where you
get ripped off on the net.


Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 11:37:35 +0900
From: Masaya Toyokawa (toyokawa@LIB.BEKKOAME.OR.JP)
Subject: 4ad-jp web site update


hello,

4ad japanese releases web site is online again.
the url is
(yes, it is in US :^)

regards,
---
Masaya Toyokawa
National Research Institute of Aquaculture
mtoyokaw@nria.affrc.go.jp

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 22:21:03 -0500
From: Srilank@AOL.COM Krzystof Kieslowski, 54, passed recently in Warsaw following heart bypass surgery. He was the filmmaker who created the three colors trilogy (Blue, White, & Red) among others. I recall a lengthy thread mid last year regarding his work, and thought that this would be of note to those who had an interest in his films. jason srilank@aol.com

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 20:33:36 -0600
From: Me (neitzl@TEZCAT.COM)
Subject: violane and halfgifts


hi
=20
  I have converted these two songs for "netability" play.  meaning you need
a free player to hear them over the internet.
  try going to
   http://www.tezcat.com/~neitzl
   and follow the iwave link.
    i hope to get the rest of the songs on their soon, but i havent found
too much time to do that yet.
   Drop me a line, or something, if you would want the rest there, if not,
i'll shut down that page soon.
  take care
ernesto

=D6=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=
=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=
=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3=D3
"You are the sweetness in my eyes         You are an apple in disguise
 You are the sweetness i need for life    You are the sweetness in my eyes"
                                      =20


Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 18:43:50 -0800
From: Vada Pinson (brettg@NETCOM.COM)
Subject: Re: ESP Continent


> I don't think you're overreacting; however, I also think this is all a matter 
f taste.
> Personally, I like all the distorted, screwed-up bits on the disc.  They provi
e an
> entertaining counterpoint to the overall atmosphere of the album, and they kin
a keep you
> on your toes (again, this is entirely a matter of preference, but I like surpr
ses in my
> music, especially surprises that are both totally left-field yet somehow congr
ent, and
> perhaps this is why I thoroughly love all the cleverness that flows out of Noi
e Camp,
> Livonia).

I think you have hit on my point exactly, that static piece of noise is
not original at all in that the same thing is found on the liquorice
album. In both cases it comes off as being for the same reason - to seem so
"ironic". It irritates me. I do not want
this to be taken that I do not like ESP, I do. On the other hand, the
liquorice album was pretty dull.

On another subject, I got the Bowery Electric as well. It is a bit
overdone for me. As far as Kranky releases go, that first Labradford
album cannot be beat.

Brett

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 21:15:28 -0600
From: a bear of very little brain (hk@NEOSOFT.COM)
Subject: Prog Uber Alles (Re: a question)


Jens Alfke wrote:
> In other words: Yes, Pink Floyd, Genesis, ELP ...
> It was a good idea at first but eventually succumbed to pompousness and
> pretentiousness.
>
> Mostly dead now although a few crusties still worship it. Prog was one of
> the primary things that punk was designed to tear down and destroy.

Oh, I don't know about that, Jens.  While you do have your armies of crusties wo
shipping their
cherished Van Der Graaf Generator LP's in the year of our lard, 1996, I think th
re are elements of prog
rock permeating the current indie scene through the work of folks like Rachel's,
Stereolab, UI,
Tortoise, Slint, Trans Am, and the more out-and-out rawk outfits like Helmet, So
ndgarden, and Bitch
Magnet that opted for song structures that are a little less linear than your st
ndard 4/4 and 3/4.  To
an extent, the first two Pale Saints albums (as well as the first Throwing Muses
LP) could be considered
to have a marked prog influence.  Galaxie 500 and Spacemen 3 have also acknowled
ed some debt to that
wide-reaching prog umbrella through their hats-offs to the Red Crayola (via cove
s of "Victory Garden"
and "Transparent Radiation," respectively), and I think there's a noticeable Sof
 Machine influence in
the Damon and Naomi records (ditto Spoonfed Hybrid).

Personally, I like weird time signatures, long songs, concept albums, classical/
azz influences, and
non-rock instrumentation, and I think it's fair to say that many a "cool" and/or
"indie" band or record
from the last five years exhibit one or more of these characteristics.  What I d
spise are old farts who
just won't fess up that they've pissed away all their talent and refuse give up 
Yes, Pink Floyd,
Genesis, ELP, etc.), and their typical out-of-touch fans who are about as milita
tly close-minded as the
out-of-touch fans of "modern rock".

To say the least, as long as people like Holger Czukay, Robert Fripp, Daevid All
n, Nik Turner, Steve
Hillage, and such are making records (and they still are), prog's still here wit
 us, for better or for
worse.


Kurdt Loder, errr, [thwack!] I mean hk
--
"Prog-rock?  Like grunge from Czechoslovakia?"
--
hk@neosoft.com and farrago@delphi.com or http://www.neosoft.com/~hk/
"cos you're the latest hotshot britpop poet laureate" -- stephen duffy